Men and Madonna/Whore

In preparation for my big move, I decided to switch the zip code and city name on each of my online profiles.  This has already resulted in quite a few new men writing me emails.  It was exciting for a minute, but what with trying to pack and the ten million things I need to get done, it’s getting to be a little much.  Perhaps I should have waited.

Anyhoo, I can hardly keep up, but there have already been a couple of interesting prospects.  One of the men called me on the phone today.  I’m so glad he did, because it helped me to realize I will NEVER be interested in this guy, despite a decent profile and good looks. 

He’s some kind of bodybuilder, or so he felt the need to tell me at least 3 or 4 times, and the pics would seem to back that up.  He also claimed to be an architect and a personal trainer, that makes upwards of 80,000 per year.  Whatever.  I’m pretty sure he’s full of shit, lol..

Throughout the course of the conversation, he told me that:

A. He wants to get me pregnant (WTF, why do I keep coming across this with men??) He said not to worry, he had every plan of taking care of “his child”.  (::: blink, blink :::::)

B. That he lives with a “much older” woman because she and her husband split up and she needed someone to “protect” her from him, but that they have a huge house, and both do their “own thing”.  (Yeah, nice way to try and cover up that she is your sugar Mommy, lmao).  Seriously though, there is nothing attractive about a 40 something man that needs to be taken care of like a child.

C.  Tried to tell me he was 21, then switched it to “between 40 and 45”.  Dude, I don’t want a 21 year old guy.  How is this even supposed to make him more attractive??  I’m 37.  I like men that are a little more mature.

D.  Told me he is a “sex addict”, then proceeded to tell me a story about some woman he went on a date with, but wouldn’t have sex with her, because she seemed to be giving it away “too easily”.  (:::: GAG ::::) 

E.  Asked me if I had stretch marks and said that he hoped my stomach wasn’t “all torn up” from having kids.  Nice.  Yeah, now I absolutely NEVER want to get naked in front of this guy.  I mean, that is the part of my body I am probably the most insecure about.  Why the hell would you say something like that to a mom, before you have even met? SMFH

F. Told me that normally women are the ones who hit HIM up on OKCupid (where we met) but that he saw something, he couldn’t figure out what it was, that was attractive about me.  EYEROLL.  I know damn well women aren’t hitting him up left and right on the dating sites (I did just experiment with this after all, haha).  Plus, this stuff about not knowing what he found attractive about me was almost offensive.

G.  Claimed he was a personal trainer at a particular gym.  My former brother in law is also a personal trainer, I think at that same gym, so I commented on that and he quickly switched it to a gym with the same name in a different (suburb) city.  Then he said that actually, he doesn’t work for the gym itself, but brings in people he trains and just does it there, and that he is helping the gym indirectly that way.  Mmmkay…

H.  Went on about how he needed a woman to be faithful to him, right after telling me that his ex used to want him to have threesomes with her and her girlfriends all the time.  UGH…

Do I need to go through the entire alphabet here?  Haha….I feel like I could, but in any case, no way Jose, am I messing with this guy.

I’ve come across some other interesting (and more promising) men on there, but I want to use this,  to make a point about men and their Madonna/Whore complexes.  It’s one of those things that just perplexes and drives me absolutely crazy with annoyance at the male species.  I DETEST the whole Madonna/whore dichotomy, as I wrote about in On Being a Slut. Kdaddy also recently wrote a blog on the topic, that got me thinking, and wanting to contribute my two cents.

Then I got another email on OKCupid, and it isn’t the only or first guy who has asked me this:  “Do you REALLY want casual sex?”  Apparently, when I first signed up for the site, ONE of the boxes I checked was for “casual sex”.  I think I clicked on that as WELL as, long or short term relationships, dating, and a handful of choices that were available as for what I was looking for at the time. 

The “casual sex” thing though, it gets guys every time.  I don’t mean “gets” them in the sense that they want to fuck, though that is often the case, but gets them all freaked out!!  Apparently, for many men, it is just UNTHINKABLE, that a girl like me, might have deliberately checked the CASUAL SEX button.  OMG!

This guy was unique because he actually bothered to follow it up with another email, when I ignored him. That let me know I was indeed correct, in assuming that he meant it as a negative judgement, rather than his wanting sex with me. 

Here is his second email:  “Actually after reading your answers to the questions on here, I guess maybe you are looking for that. I was trying to be helpful because it automatically marks all the options when you first sign up.”  Gee, thanks for the “help”. 

Shame, shame on me for wanting casual sex.  Once a guy wrote me a big long letter explaining why it wasn’t okay for women to seek out casual sex and that no man would want me if I gave it away so easily.  Thanks.  I so needed a lecture from a random guy on a dating site about how I should conduct my sex life. One thing is for sure, that attitude is not helping the guy get a date, at least from me!!

I’ve always been honestly puzzled and disturbed that so many men split women into the two categories of Madonna/Whore.  I find it very difficult to understand why a woman’s past sexual experiences would be such a bad thing.  If anything, experience helps a woman to learn what she likes in bed and better communicate it to you.

I’ve never been able to quite comprehend how men can have sex with women they consider “whores,” then disrespect them for doing so.  Yet, its common.  Extremely, extremely common for men to sleep around all they want and only settle down with someone who is sexually inexperienced, that they see as more worthy of love.

On some level, I know this is because men see sexual promiscuity as a threat.  If they dare to let down their guard and love a woman who sleeps around, then she might leave them for another guy.  I do understand this, to an extent, it’s just like, come on guys, don’t you have any more confidence than that? 

They trust themselves, to sleep around with many women, but always come back to the woman they fell in love with, or married.  At least many do, yet they can’t trust women to do the same.  I wonder why? 

What bugs me the most is that men do this splitting thing where they won’t be affectionate with a woman they consider a slut.  They treat her as though she is less deserving of sweetness and romance.  Is this some kind of repressed anger? 

Sometimes it goes so far as the guy shaming a woman he DOES have feelings for because of her sexual desires WITH HIM.  I’ve been on the receiving end of this plenty of times and it just leaves me sort of speechless.  You don’t want me to be too sexual WITH YOU?  WTF? 

They won’t usually ADMIT this but it happens a lot.  Quite often the same guy claims to want a “lady in the streets and a freak in the sheets”.  Yet when the rubber meets the road, this is a threat to him and he doesn’t really want that.  She has to fit one or the other mold in his head.

The whole thing bothers me so much because I LOVE being able to give and receive love and affection with a man.  I also LOVE sex.  Finding someone who is cool enough to allow me to do BOTH of those things is like looking for a needle in a haystack. 

It’s like every guy I meet wants me either to be his girlfriend and lack sexual desire, (unless of course its for other women, to bring back to him) or he finds out I want to have lots of sex and doesn’t want to talk or have an emotional connection with me.  I don’t like being pigeonholed into either of those boxes. 

This makes it very hard for me on dating sites.  If I meet guys on a “vanilla” site, there never seems to be an appropriate time to admit I like sex and going to swinger parties.  Many times they just “assume” I want monogamy and that can be frustrating.  When I try to hint at more, then they are like oh, she just wants a fuck buddy, and out goes the possibility of anything special.

Yet, meeting men on a swinger site, they just assume you are all out for the sex and act like its crazy for anyone on there to seek out a relationship.  Well, not totally, because as you have seen if you read my blog regularly, they often want ME to stop sleeping around and just help them get some. :p  They want a one-sided relationship, where you are committed to them, but not vice- versa, like every other guy out there, lol.

What I really want, is a man who can handle me, as is, that I don’t have to pretend with.  Or…several of them.  (Ha) Okay, not really, because when I fall for someone I do tend to have a one track mind.  Not necessarily sexually, but emotionally.  Sometimes it’s sexually too, but eventually my curiosity gets the best of me.  I still think it would be fun to play together, and probably separately as well.

I think something like what Mr. Firm has, sounds ideal.  His girlfriend has it made!  He’s one of the few men I’ve met who seems to be lacking Madonna/whore issues.  I’m still marveling that he hasn’t seemed to change his attitude or level of affection for me after reading my blog.  I’m pretty impressed! 

So I know, if he is like that, there have to be other men out there the same way.  Just not enough of them, lol.  Or, more likely, they just aren’t single!  :p 

Maybe, I’m guilty of wanting to have my cake and eat it too.  But what is the point of having a cake if you aren’t going to eat it?  I’ve never understood that either….;)

15 thoughts on “Men and Madonna/Whore

  1. Here’s what I know about men: We want a woman who will give us the booty easily, few questions asked… but if she’s willing to give up that easily to us, we believe she would easily give it up to anyone else – and we’d rather she didn’t do that. The better that pussy is, the more “protective” we get about it – you see this one a lot in your exploits, right?

    Is this Madonna/whore? I don’t think so; our attitude about the pussy is ingrained into us over too many centuries to think about. Sure, we want a lady in public and a whore in bed, but does her being a lady mean that we expect her to be virtuous? Maybe and that depends on what a man considers a lady to be… but to see her as the guardian of virtue but revile her because she wants sex, well, that just doesn’t make a lot of sense to me, not in the context that this syndrome presents itself and even more so when it’s not a mental disorder, like having an Oedipus complex.

    My, my – you just keep running into the oddest men, don’t you?

    • LOL Clearly, there are a lot of odd men out there!! Hahaha I do understand getting protective and possessive. I mean, to an extent, I LIKE that. But that they get so upset over past exploits, or think that a woman can’t be a good mom or a person deserving of love and affection, just because she likes sex, I don’t understand at all. The whole “I don’t want her kissing my kids with that mouth” attitude is bewildering.

      I think a lot of men do equate being a “lady” with being virtuous and sexually pure. I’m all for being virtuous, if you mean honest and morally a good person, but if you mean chaste? Hell no! I think, really, that women and men who deny their sexual urges are more dishonest than honest, and how is that a virtue?

      I’ve never understood at all how men can put down women who have a lot of sex, yet at the same time want to sleep with them. For me, I need to be able to respect the people I am fucking, to continue wanting to sleep with them, though I guess for men it’s just not the same.

  2. I dont have that issue but i havent come across any women that want to have just sex, i prefer that i dont like the whole dating scene its bs, i hope one day to meet a girl just want sex and after we have it we part ways no lovely doubly shiiit….

    • I think a lot of women do want that, but we want our emotional needs met too, from somewhere. Society tells women that we shouldn’t seek sex outside of that, so we have to go through a lot more bullshit on both sides. If women could feel loved despite having sexual dalliances elsewhere, like men are able to, it would be different.

  3. i totally understand i think a woman should have a guy for each on of those needs(money,emotional,sex), i just want to be the one to provide the sexually need only…thats selfish of me i know but its how im built.i feel men and women are so different that we only make sense is when we come together for sex…and if a man spend too much time under a women he become feminine a weak ass man..

    • That’s interesting. I suppose if two people become super enmeshed in a relationship, that could happen. I never worry about becoming masculine when hanging around a guy too much, but I guess that’s neither here nor there, lol.

      I think it is important for people to remain individuals and keep separate interests in their relationship. I DIDN’T do that with my ex husband and suffered the consequences.

      Anyhow, back to the topic, I guess a lot of men want that, but are you saying you don’t want ANYONE to fill an emotional need? Just fuck buddies all around?

  4. Glad you saw all the red flags with that one guy. He definitely was full of shit and not worth a meet. I think it probably has something to do with the site you found him on. Lots of BS there.

    As for him wanting to get you pregnant, I can only guess that it might be something that is said in your profile that leads these guys to that conclusion. Not sure, but I have to laugh because that’s the LAST thing I would say.

    I disagree with Kdaddy a bit (for the first time) that men don’t like their women looking for/liking sex elsewhere when in a committed relationship. That’s why I’m a swinger. Although not currently in a committed relationship, if I do find myself there, I want a lady who wants to share that pussy with others. And I want her to be open and honest about enjoying her sexuality. I guess that might be why I stick to swingers sites versus dating sites. I’ve seen plenty of SFs with comments about their love of sex/swinging and desire for a LTR. That’s fine. So I’d stick to the swing sites if I were you.

    • Darren, of course, you understand that men who are totally dedicated to swinging are going to feel differently but if you look at the kind of men Lovergirl’s been dealing with lately, you will see that what I said is true; a lot of them behave as if her pussy belongs to them and show great reluctance in allowing her to share her stuff with some she chooses to and when she does share, they ain’t too happy about it. Is this Madonna/whore? Could be, depending on whether or not you want to nitpick it but it does reveal a pattern of behavior that suggests that it could be in effect, even in the supposedly open world of swinging.

      So when you look at men who aren’t into swinging or are clearly too immature to be swingers, in their minds, there is no way in hell that he’s gonna be cool with her having sex outside of their relationship – that’s just not supposed to happen. Then think about how a man is going to react to learn that she’s giving her pussy to almost anyone who asks – is he gonna see her as someone without virtue and as a whore? Will he see her as such when, most likely, he’s the reason why she’s out there giving up the box because he’s got some shit going on with him that makes him not fuck her as he should… but he could easily go out and fuck some other woman with great gusto?


  5. Kdaddy,
    I guess being in my frame of mind, I’ll never understand some of these guys. They say women are crazy, but seems like some guys are worse. I think some of the women swingers are a lot more together than their male partners as far as knowing what they want and enjoy and then getting it. Without the drama and jealousy that a lot of these guys seem to create. They say women create drama, but the opposite may be true. Hmmm indeed. Whatever I’m doing I’ll just keep doing. I’m having fun and avoiding drama so far. Hope my years of luck hold out.

    • It’s the men who create the drama when they either try to keep their woman from openly sharing the pussy or try to control who she can share it with; if she wanted to do another woman, he’s not gonna have much of a problem with that… but if she wanted to do the guy with the biggest dick in the room (and the awesome rep to match), nope, ain’t gonna happen no matter how much she wants to get that awesome dick. I’m not 100% sure that this truly reflects Madonna/whore but if you just look at the behaviors you can see even in swinging, well, there’s something pretty smelly going on here and at the root of it is some guy trying to protect his pussy from all the swinging dicks while trying to get all the other pussy that’s available. I’m sure you know just how fucked up swinging can get and why it can get that way – now imagine how much worse it is in the vanilla world and the one place that if you were gonna see Madonna/whore, that’s where you’re going to see it.

      Still, the more I think about this, the less sense it makes but I also suppose it all depends on how a man either looks at a woman or believes a woman should always be… and that’s just so unrealistic that it defies both logic and common sense to treat her like a Madonna but also see her as a whore because the real truth is that she’s not a Madonna – she wants to get her cobwebs cleared out just as much as any other woman would; preferably, she’d like the guy she’s with to do the clearing but if he’s gonna treat her as if having sex with her would soil her, there are other men.

      It’s a stupid way to behave and so much that I can’t even imagine what it would take to behave like that because everything I’ve ever learned tells me that it’s insane to behave in such a fashion… but I guess that’s me. I love my woman… but do I see her as a Madonna or a whore? Nope; she’s no innocent but she also has a great deal of self-respect to not behave in a way that would get her labeled as a whore.

  6. It’s interesting, that not long after I wrote this, Mr. Married Man hit me up again and I told him I will be moving his way. He’s pretty excited and has already told me that since I am moving there now I need to know that he doesn’t like to share with other men! :p He says he’s going to have me so “touched out” that I won’t need anyone else. Anyhow, I’m just shaking my head because um, he’s still married, lol, and thinks I should only fuck him. He’s just as bad as the rest of them (and was one that wanted to impregnate me too), only he’s better in bed, so its harder to say no!

  7. Say yes at your own downfall with him if you’re not up front that you’ll fuck whomever you want to. Funny that he wants to own you and impregnate you while he’s married. WTF?? Be truthful and tell him you just want to see him because he’s good for sex only. Then see what he says. That should give you a clear indication of whether to continue on or avoid him like the plague.

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